Noobscraft
News, Announcements & Updates => Server Announcements => Topic started by: Foob on 15 Nov 2013, 20:15:06
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Hey all,
I understand that everyone had hoped to be playing v6 by now and believe me, so did the entire team. However, there are reasons why we haven't released and those reasons outweigh any need to rush or push out a release just for the sake of downtime.
Let me briefly explain the chunky system and direction we are taking v6. As you know we have been planning and preparing v6 to last much longer than previous versions, this means a lot of thought and preparation has gone into keeping the world clean and fresh for years to come. Our aims are to minimize the amount of inactive builds or "ruins" and generally just have a world full of active buildings and players, who are devoted to our server.
The vision meant we had to create a custom system, which you all know by now as "Chunky" ~ The way chunky works is that it records the entire world data as it was naturally formed (Before any players even touch it) this will mean the saved recording will be like the first time you back up a computer, completely fresh and untouched. This saved data will be continuously used throughout the entire version; as an example: Someone wishes to reset their land or an automated inactivity/ban land refresh happens, which means the data will be grabbed and the chunks will be restored to the time before players walk the very earth.
So why can't you release in 1.6.4? Well, in 1.6.4 the way data is saved and the way we wanted to save data will no longer work in 1.7.2. Meaning any data we save of the fresh world would not roll back, due to the data being unreadable and old. This is due to Minecraft itself changing the way world chunk data is saved in 1.7.2.
What would have happened if we released in 1.6.4?
Here are a list of possible outcomes of releasing on 1.6.4
- Data is saved the old way and thus by the time 1.7.2 hits the fresh world data, which is the source of data where backups are pulled from to keep the world fresh will not work. Completely nullifying the entire plan for the version. Which would result in another world reset a year later, due to the world being a mess again!
- The system not functioning correctly due to these changes, which would cause player block and inventory data to be rolled back or possibly lost. Losing items 1 month after the version hits... disaster!?!
- The entire auction system will be broken when 1.7.2 hits, meaning any saved items on there or any items currently listed will be entirely lost. Due to the way 1.7.2 has changed block and item saved data
- Towns being completely lost due to Towny not updating their 1.7.2 saving methods
I hope this gives those people asking "Release on 1.6.4" the answer they needed, it is not ideal and it is not going to benefit us in the long run.
However, we are devising a backup plan ~ Which means we are looking into creating a super converter, the converter will change all old data to the new data. This comes with a price! ~ lots and lots of time and devotion which could be spent on ensuring a safer and more reliable release on 1.7.2. Again, this is not ideal and would only be created in the worst possible scenario in which Bukkit don't feel they can update for a long, long time.
In saying that, we are still relying on Bukkit to continue their hard work at getting 1.7.2 out and remember, the converter is merely a backup plan and is something we are not going to push too much for as we believe it will not only waste time but also mean a less stable v6 release as it could have been.
I hope you all understand and don't vent too much frustration towards us, we are trying our best to ensure v6 will be stable and reliable server for years to come. Rushing the fundamental core development and launch would forever debilitate the version, which is not something we want to happen after all of our work on the version. Since we released all those years ago we have always tried to give our players the best possible experience and service, we aren't miracle workers but we do try our very hardest. We do this because of our great community and the sense of friendship and devotion that our players give to this little thing we call 'Noobstown' so please, just hold on tight and wait that little bit longer. We are thankful for those who still support us and will be there from the day we launch the future of our server.
Keeping busy, preparing the version ~ Waiting on news from Bukkit,
Noobscraft team
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I'm quite glad you made this update. The frustration within players has definitely got outta hand and I have a feeling that no matter what you say, people won't care but I hope that this does help some people hold on just a little bit longer.
I stand by the admins and this server and understand that releasing it too early would be a step in the wrong direction and I've tried expressing that to other players and being unsuccessful....this is exactly what we needed, was an update. So thanks foob! :)
-gg
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We know you are working hard and tip of the hat to you all. Hope you all aren't striving for perfection.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perfect_is_the_enemy_of_good (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perfect_is_the_enemy_of_good)
Max
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I'm quite glad you made this update. The frustration within players has definitely got outta hand and I have a feeling that no matter what you say, people won't care but I hope that this does help SOME people hold on just a little bit longer.
I stand by the admins and this server and understand that releasing it too early would be a step in the wrong direction and I've tried expressing that to other players and being unsuccessful....this is exactly what we needed, was an update. So thanks foob! :)
-gg
Thank you, the main reason why we decided to write this article was mainly due to conversation on the forum about releasing early and arguments spinning a little out of control as a result. This post hopefully makes it crystal clear why we are delaying, and the implications of releasing early.
We know you are working hard and tip of the hat to you all. Hope you all aren't striving for perfection.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perfect_is_the_enemy_of_good (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perfect_is_the_enemy_of_good)
Max
We aren't striving for perfection, we are just trying our very best as we have always with Noobstown. Thanks for the kind messages Max.
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I cant imagine how much work has and is going into getting this server up and running, but I do appreciate all the hard efforts being put into it.
Just looking forward to it getting here, Ive been lurking on the site waiting for news of V6 coming.
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I cant imagine how much work has and is going into getting this server up and running, but I do appreciate all the hard efforts being put into it.
Just looking forward to it getting here, Ive been lurking on the site waiting for news of V6 coming.
Thanks, the team and Noobstown looks forward to seeing you around again too!
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I totally agree and support what the team is doing. Instead of a 'now' fix, it's always good to stand back, take a look at the big picture and think of how the decisioning, even the smallest of things, affects future state.
After a proper and successful 1.7 conversion I'm sure there won't be any regrets.
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We aren't striving for perfection, we are just trying our very best as we have always with Noobstown. Thanks for the kind messages Max.
That's good to hear. I have seen people in broken marriages and in the hospital because of their insistance to perfection. Give yourselves a break once in a while and go do something else fun to clear your mind. You'll come back refreshed and better prepared for the work ahead.
Max
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Could you say, with this information then, that the initial scheduled release, had it been slightly earlier, would have turned rather disastrous? It all makes sense now. I had not had any compatibility issues with my single player maps in 1.7 except biomes. Chunky issues are a big deal, however. I just hope that Mojang use this code update to last for a long time to prevent these headaches for everyone in the future.
It is a risk to launch with 1.64, and now we know the risk is too much to be worth it.
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:D finally an update! This helps a lot!
I'm quite glad you made this update. The frustration within players has definitely got outta hand and I have a feeling that no matter what you say, people won't care but I hope that this does help some people hold on just a little bit longer.
I stand by the admins and this server and understand that releasing it too early would be a step in the wrong direction and I've tried expressing that to other players and being unsuccessful....this is exactly what we needed, was an update. So thanks foob! :)
-gg
Im guessing you're implying me on that?
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Can't wait for it to be sorted and I know it must be frustrating, but it'll be worth the wait.
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I think we should declare V6 dead and call it V7 at this point ;)
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I had not had any compatibility issues with my single player maps in 1.7 except biomes. Chunky issues are a big deal, however. I just hope that Mojang use this code update to last for a long time to prevent these headaches for everyone in the future.
It is a risk to launch with 1.64, and now we know the risk is too much to be worth it.
I can assure you that very BAD things can happen to chunks in 1.6.x. and also in 1.7.2.
The worst problem I was able to permanently recreate involves "physical" chunks (not 16x16 ones, from I what I could observe I assume it's related to how the physics engine divide the space, a usual practice to minimize the impact of collision detection and updates) of each test world I created, recreated the problem multiple times and reported the problem in Mojira.
In the "best" cases the console is flooded with corruption errors and the physics engine simply dies.
At least you can see what's going on but the world is still ruined.
In the worst case it's less obvious and stuff simply stop working (weird collisions , weird redstone behaviour, etc).
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Thanks for the Update Foob, did not know it would affect the server that much when I created the "Opening The Server In 1.6.4 (http://www.noobscraft.com/noobstown-general/opening-the-server-in-1-6-4-15883/)" Topic, glad that you guys decided to wait now, really wonder how many people are gone be gone once the server is back up, a lot of people got tired from the waiting, which sucks :/
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I dont know if ill be able to play long in v6, im getting pretty sick of minecraft, done everything there is to do. I know I will be back just dont know how long :/
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ty for keeping us updated as usual :)
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:D finally an update! This helps a lot!
I'm quite glad you made this update. The frustration within players has definitely got outta hand and I have a feeling that no matter what you say, people won't care but I hope that this does help some people hold on just a little bit longer.
I stand by the admins and this server and understand that releasing it too early would be a step in the wrong direction and I've tried expressing that to other players and being unsuccessful....this is exactly what we needed, was an update. So thanks foob! :)
-gg
Im guessing you're implying me on that?
no harry I am no implying you specifically. I've seen many, many people feel the same way you do about the server and this November update is exactly what everyone needed.
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Thanks for the update Foob.
EvilSteph has posted another update this morning and it looks like they are getting "closer" to a development build....which is one step closer to a recommended build.
Around 220,000 lines of code have changed in the 1.7.2 release that they are steadily working through, hence the longer than usual update time.
Still excited waiting to finally get to take a look around V6 :)
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glad that you guys decided to wait now, really wonder how many people are gone be gone once the server is back up, a lot of people got tired from the waiting, which sucks :/
People thinking about leaving (probably to find another server) should take into account that this situation is global and not just Noobscraft-related.
There is no server that's going to have a 1.7.x stable version with plugins support at the moment.
The ones making their own pseudo-bukkit version are not even using a proper dev build and when a dev build finally comes out, no sensible admin would just install that and pray to never have problems.
Forge is more or less in the same boat.
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Keep up the good work Team! :D
In the meantime ill be playing on 1.6.4 servers :)
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Thanks for the update Joe, I have been trying to make sense of it but sorry, I can't.
Just release as planned, and wipe the whole thing when we get to the 1.7.2 release.
Yes, that would give us only a few weeks of play in V6 before its all wiped for V6.1 but hey, some play is better the NO play, at least in my book.
Your explanation about why it would not work involves upgrading the world from 1.6.4 to 1.7.2, if I understand correctly, hence my suggestion : release now, dont upgrade in the future, but wipe, use the backup file you have and start over.
Heck, you could even just restore V5 and let us have some fun with that !
Effectively the guys at bukkit now decide when we will be able to play, I thought YOU were in control, my mistake I guess.
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Thanks for the update Joe, I have been trying to make sense of it but sorry, I can't.
Just release as planned, and wipe the whole thing when we get to the 1.7.2 release.
Yes, that would give us only a few weeks of play in V6 before its all wiped for V6.1 but hey, some play is better the NO play, at least in my book.
Your explanation about why it would not work involves upgrading the world from 1.6.4 to 1.7.2, if I understand correctly, hence my suggestion : release now, dont upgrade in the future, but wipe, use the backup file you have and start over.
Heck, you could even just restore V5 and let us have some fun with that !
Effectively the guys at bukkit now decide when we will be able to play, I thought YOU were in control, my mistake I guess.
Bukkit has always been in control of servers to an extent and will continue to do so, they provide the framework for all the plugins to run. Without bukkit, there wouldn't be Minecraft servers as you know today, would be more or less vanilla Minecraft. I understand your personal choice of what to do but that isn't going to benefit the entire community nor give a good impression, people want to join v6 and start building knowing things are going to be around a whole lot longer.
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another update. woohoo! the noobstown updates have been relatively quiet, but thats not really relevant to the topic or something like that. essentially im wondering when the estimated new release date of v6 here, not trying to make everyone rage if there is an estimated date(idk where im going with that) but i just wanna know SOME random estimated date for v6. are we looking at the release possibly being in around february-april 2014? or is that overkill?
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Could we get a little more information on what the decision process will be as far as time frame goes? I ask this because in the bukkit update post, they mention specifically that they will most likely not be able to create a stable build (at least any time soon). Does that mean the development build (when released) will be used as the base of the server? I know the idea is to release smoothly and have no issues but that sounds unlikely simply based on the way bukkit is talking about issues with the update. Can anyone provide more insight into that?
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When it comes to Minecraft, things have never been 100% stable. I'm sure most of you remember the bugs, issues, and random weirdness that would happen on the server and us mods saying we had no idea lol. Once the admins take a look at the build, weigh it's stability and known issues against potential losses and aggrivation of the player base, we'll be informed of what's going to happen. It's ALL about making sure the players first experience with the new server is what it was promised to be with the announcement earlier this year. I wish for nothing more than to play Noobstown with everyone again, but only if it will be enjoyable, lasting, and what it was always meant to be from the start:
"The best Minecraft online experience out there"
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I understand your personal choice of what to do but that isn't going to benefit the entire community nor give a good impression, people want to join v6 and start building knowing things are going to be around a whole lot longer.
Point taken, will join ranks and wait for it to come on-line.
"The best Minecraft online experience out there"
Nah, not going to say it, to easy......
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Thankyou for the update i will carry on waiting patiently for v6 i thinks its good that the team are taking the time to release properly and make noobstown even greater than it already is but i will happily wait as long as it take until then i have a temporary server to play on ;-)
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Thank you Joe , I had a feeling Bukkit was most of the hold-up, I've been patiently waiting, trying to tie up loose ends , and trying to find a replacement mayor for the town I've been running on another server, the problem is finding reliable people that can be on often. I'm glad you made this update, I can wait but I don't want to, Impatiently waiting patiently, thanks for keeping us up-dated Foob I know it's going to be awesome.
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As an experienced beta(and sometimes even alpha) tester it is my firmly held belief that a great thing half-finished is better than nothing at all. I'd rather play something good that's broken and buggy than something lame that's polished and shiny.
I guess that's why I liked Arkham Origins, it was a rushed release full of bugs, but it was ultimately a good story and good game.
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A rushed server is probably not for the best! Or something like the following could happen!
Link removed
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A rushed server is probably not for the best! Or something like the following could happen!
LINK REMOVED
I don't mean to crash your party but wouldn't this be considered advertising ?
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Actually Ive never heard of that server before, and only linked to the page talking about how the server was not working and bugged out!
I should have thought about posting a link like that, but it really did not occur to me that it may be thought of as advertising.
Sorry ItsLawrence!
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I know its still a ways away, but what is the plan for noobmas if we don't have the server up and running?
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I had gotten a bit tired of how much progress I had made in my playthrough.
A while ago I had just stopped playing but because of this update, expect me to be one of your daily players again. Best of luck to you on developing the plugin and map.
-Mcbrick
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That's some really good information to have shared with the community! While I'm quite sure Mojang changing the way the data is stored was a move in the right direction with all the updates they've been putting out lately I am saddened that it inadvertently sabotaged the work you and the Noobs team had done/been working on.
My wife & I have been anticipating the release of V6 since it was announced. I believe that others like she and I that have played on Noobstown for a good while will continue waiting patiently while all the bugs/features are ironed out in the fashion that you all want it to.
Here's to hoping things all fall into place for you guys that are working so hard to make sure that v6 is the stable, fun place that you want it to be for everyone!
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Bukkit announced today that it has just made available development builds for 1.7.2.
Max
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Bukkit announced today that it has just made available development builds for 1.7.2.
Max
wait what? really?
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This :
http://forums.bukkit.org/threads/craftbukkit-for-minecraft-1-7-2-development-build-is-now-available.200472/ (http://forums.bukkit.org/threads/craftbukkit-for-minecraft-1-7-2-development-build-is-now-available.200472/)
Now it is somewhat safer to assume it will take the "usual" amount of time to move on with the builds.
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Yea, I also checked how Optifine developers are on Optifine 1.7.2, and it was at 5%.. 1.7.2 killed so many things.. ;-;
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Bukkit is still in Development building stage... it'll be January at least before they're done ;-;
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Hey guys, does the new, unsupported version of CraftBukkit have any bearing on our server, or is it just too unreliable to implement? Is this something you will test with the plugins and see how it goes, or do you wait for a fully supported build before continuing? Thanks and keep up the good work?
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Really need this server up and running! I need my Minecraft fix!